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Services & Stories 
Why marketing and product need to play nice 
-> A TALK GIVEN AT GOOGLE #FIRESTARTERS ON 17TH SEPT 2014...
I’VE ADDED COMMENTARY (LIKE THIS) TO THE ORIGINAL SLIDES 
SO I CAN EXPLAIN STUFF AND POINT TO THINGS! 
RIGHT, LET’S GO…
SO, I WAS INVITED TO SPEAK ABOUT THIS INTERSECTION 
Product 
innovation 
Marketing 
(THIS SLIDE ALSO HAD THE SPICE GIRLS’ ...
OF COURSE IT’S MESSIER THAN A VENN DIAGRAM.. 
Smart arse
AND QUITE A SENSITIVE TOPIC 
“I wish marketing would stop 
wasting everyone's time and 
just go back to making ads” 
- Pro...
I INTEND TO BE LESS ANGRY AND MORE… CONSTRUCTIVE! 
http://tvcinemaemusica.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/ 
bruce_banner_chang...
AFTER ALL, I COME FROM MARKETING, AND HAVE LONG BEEN OBSESSED WITH… 
Doing useful things 
that get talked about 
http://wa...
I’VE TRIED TO MAKE ‘USEFUL’ THINGS 
FOR BRANDS FOR TWELVE YEARS… 
(PRETTY SURE NO ONE KNEW WHAT A PODCAST WAS BACK THEN) 
...
MOVING TO A DIGITAL AGENCY MEANT 
ENDLESS WAYS TO CREATE NEW VALUE 
Announces fresh goods on Twitter Aggregates film revie...
BUT THAT VALUE DIDN’T OFTEN LAST VERY LONG :( 
I searched around for examples of ‘brand utility’ from marketing 
agencies ...
ALL THIS LED TO TWO EPIPHANIES… 
(THIs IS WHAT AN 
EPIPHANY LOOKS LIKE)
1 
“Life’s too short to make 
things no one wants” 
- Ash Maurya
2 
Differentiate the product 
before the brand 
WHY DIFFERENTIATE BRANDS THAT HAVE PARITY PRODUCTS WHEN 
YOU CAN DIFFERENT...
THOSE EPIPHANIES BROUGHT ME HERE —> 
WHERE WE MAKE THINGS PEOPLE USE DAILY 
2012 - 
Reinvented ITV News Collaborative tool...
Was it really so different? 
(Moving from digital marketing to a digital product innovation company)
My first six weeks at MxM 
Feeling pretty invincible; 
I have super skills! 
Something… feels.. different. 
My clever comm...
IT WAS PROFOUNDLY DIFFERENT 
! 
I HADN’T CHANGED AGENCY, I HAD CHANGED CAREER(!) 
! 
I’M GOING TO EXPLAIN HOW IT WAS DIFFE...
IT ALL COMES DOWN TO… 
How success is judged
IT ALL COMES DOWN TO… 
FORGET WHETHER OUTPUT IS 
CALLED A ‘PRODUCT’ OR NOT…
FORGET WHETHER OUTPUT IS 
CALLED A ‘PRODUCT’ OR NOT… 
Are you trying to earn a momentary reaction… or an ongoing role in p...
FORGET WHETHER OUTPUT IS 
CALLED A ‘PRODUCT’ OR NOT… 
Are you trying to earn a momentary reaction… or an ongoing role in p...
A ‘product’ built to achieve 
short term marketing goals 
*is* short term marketing 
(THIS IS SO SIMPLE BUT IMPORTANT)
THIS ONE DIFFERENCE… REACTION VS ROLE 
HAS A MASSIVE IMPACT ON EVERYTHING YOU DO 
IT SHAKES THE AGENCY MODEL TO ITS CORE 
...
Marketing Product innovation 
• Ideas are the most valuable thing 
• Strategies are sold in 
• Minimum success is certain ...
Guessing what’s going 
to work is a fool’s game 
Photo: REX Features via
THE SIMPLE TRUTH IS THAT ALL STRATEGY AND ‘IDEAS’ ARE GUESSES. 
AND THAT GUESSING PRECISELY WHAT PRODUCT WILL BE LOVED BY ...
A STUDY SHOWED THAT OUT OF 400 
MBA GRADUATES FROM HARVARD… 
96.5% 
..OF THEM FAILED IN THEIR VENTURES WHEN 
FOLLOWING THE...
Don’t do upfront thinking 
How far do you go before checking?
Don’t do upfront thinking 
How far do you go before checking? 
PEOPLE GET IN SILLY ARGUMENTS ABOUT THIS; 
IT ISN’T AN ARGU...
SADLY, ONE OF THE BIGGEST BARRIERS TO SENSIBLY 
ASKING THIS QUESTION IS PEOPLE AND AGENCIES 
PROTECTING THEIR LEGACY VALUE...
and individuals 
"Institutions will try to preserve 
the problem to which they are 
the solution" 
- Clay Shirky 
- Me
SOME OF THE RISKS OF GOING TOO FAR WITHOUT CHECKING… 
You develop a tight business model, 
but it turns out people don’t w...
SOME OF THE RISKS OF GOING TOO FAR WITHOUT CHECKING… 
You design a great customer experience, 
but it turns out you can’t ...
SOME OF THE RISKS OF GOING TOO FAR WITHOUT CHECKING… 
You work out a great technology solution, 
but it compromises the re...
IT’S WHY MXM WORKS IN TIGHT CYCLES INSTEAD OF STAGES… 
LEARN MAKE TEST
BASICALLY, IT’S REALLY BLOODY COMPLEX DEVELOPING 
SUCCESSFUL DIGITAL PRODUCTS. IN FACT, THE WORD 
‘PRODUCT’ ISN’T PARTICUL...
Website 
Latest News - ITV New 
http:// 
www.itv.com/news/ 
OUR ITV NEWS SERVICE ISN’T JUST 
A ‘SITE’/‘APP’ THAT CONSUMERS...
Website 
Latest News - ITV New 
http:// 
www.itv.com/news/ 
IT’S AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT SYSTEM 
FOR JOURNALISTS TO CREATE N...
Latest News - ITV New THIS is the product 
Website 
http:// 
www.itv.com/news/ 
Brand new CMS 
Apps and site 
New workflow
‘Product’ Design 
Venture Design
DESIGNING ENTIRE VENTURES GOES WAY BEYOND SIMPLY 
CREATING A NEW APP OR SERVICE. 
WHICH IS WHY WE’VE STARTED TO HIRE AND B...
So we don’t need 
marketing then? 
WE JUST MAKE REALLY VALUABLE 
SERVICES AND THEY SELL THEMSELVES! 
Hooray!
No, it turns out 
this isn’t the case… 
http://dudesinstartupshirts.tumblr.com/ 
AND WHILE MARKETEERS TRY TO GET BETTER AT...
LOOK NO FURTHER THAN…
I ORIGINALLY SHARED A REALLY BAD (FUNNY) 
ATTEMPT AT A KICKSTARTER VIDEO TO HIGHLIGHT HOW 
BAD AT MARKETING SOME PRODUCT P...
ANYWAY… 
“No marketing” needs to 
finally stop being a badge of 
honour for product people
THESE THINGS NEED ONE ANOTHER 
service 
story 
GREAT SERVICES CREATE STORIES; 
GREAT STORIES REINFORCE THE SERVICE
BUT YOU MUST START WITH THE SERVICE! 
service 
story 
GOOD STORIES DON’T NECESSARY LEAD TO GOOD SERVICES 
(I could have go...
ALSO IMPORTANT: 
Great products lead to good 
stories, but not good storytelling
THAT ALL GOT A BIT RAMBLY. 
I TOTALLY MADE IT ALL HANG TOGETHER ON THE NIGHT 
ANYWAY…
Make useful things 
THIS IS MY JAM 
tell stories with them
Make useful things 
THIS IS MY JAM 
tell stories with them 
MARKETING FOLK NEED TO RESPECT THAT PRODUCT INNOVATION IS AN 
...
I PLAYED SOME SEXY MUSIC AT THIS POINT 
MADE EVERYONE FEEL WARM AND FUZZY 
ABOUT NEEDING ONE ANOTHER, 
THEN WENT FOR THE B...
What have I learned? 
1. Differentiate the service before the brand 
2. Spend less time guessing 
3.Great products lead to...
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Services and Stories - why marketing and product innovation need to play nice

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I gave this talk at the Google Firestarters event in London on 17th September 2014. It’s a personal tale about my transition from marketing to product innovation and an attempt to talk sense about why they’re different and why they need each other.

Publié dans : Business
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Services and Stories - why marketing and product innovation need to play nice

  1. 1. Services & Stories Why marketing and product need to play nice -> A TALK GIVEN AT GOOGLE #FIRESTARTERS ON 17TH SEPT 2014 <- @andywhitlock
  2. 2. I’VE ADDED COMMENTARY (LIKE THIS) TO THE ORIGINAL SLIDES SO I CAN EXPLAIN STUFF AND POINT TO THINGS! RIGHT, LET’S GO…
  3. 3. SO, I WAS INVITED TO SPEAK ABOUT THIS INTERSECTION Product innovation Marketing (THIS SLIDE ALSO HAD THE SPICE GIRLS’ ‘TWO BECOME ONE’ AS A SOUNDTRACK)
  4. 4. OF COURSE IT’S MESSIER THAN A VENN DIAGRAM.. Smart arse
  5. 5. AND QUITE A SENSITIVE TOPIC “I wish marketing would stop wasting everyone's time and just go back to making ads” - Product person I know
  6. 6. I INTEND TO BE LESS ANGRY AND MORE… CONSTRUCTIVE! http://tvcinemaemusica.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/ bruce_banner_change_to_hulk_wallpaper_-_1920x1200.jpg
  7. 7. AFTER ALL, I COME FROM MARKETING, AND HAVE LONG BEEN OBSESSED WITH… Doing useful things that get talked about http://wallblog.co.uk/files/2011/08/Riotcleanupbrooms.jpg
  8. 8. I’VE TRIED TO MAKE ‘USEFUL’ THINGS FOR BRANDS FOR TWELVE YEARS… (PRETTY SURE NO ONE KNEW WHAT A PODCAST WAS BACK THEN) 2002-2007
  9. 9. MOVING TO A DIGITAL AGENCY MEANT ENDLESS WAYS TO CREATE NEW VALUE Announces fresh goods on Twitter Aggregates film reviews 2008-2012
  10. 10. BUT THAT VALUE DIDN’T OFTEN LAST VERY LONG :( I searched around for examples of ‘brand utility’ from marketing agencies and more often than not, the sites and services had been taken down This is such a well known phenomenon, someone wrote a book about it
  11. 11. ALL THIS LED TO TWO EPIPHANIES… (THIs IS WHAT AN EPIPHANY LOOKS LIKE)
  12. 12. 1 “Life’s too short to make things no one wants” - Ash Maurya
  13. 13. 2 Differentiate the product before the brand WHY DIFFERENTIATE BRANDS THAT HAVE PARITY PRODUCTS WHEN YOU CAN DIFFERENTIATE THE PRODUCTS DIRECTLY !? (wHICH WILL DIFFERENTIATE THE BRAND AS A BY-PRODUCT ANYWAY!
  14. 14. THOSE EPIPHANIES BROUGHT ME HERE —> WHERE WE MAKE THINGS PEOPLE USE DAILY 2012 - Reinvented ITV News Collaborative tools for Contagious
  15. 15. Was it really so different? (Moving from digital marketing to a digital product innovation company)
  16. 16. My first six weeks at MxM Feeling pretty invincible; I have super skills! Something… feels.. different. My clever comments aren’t helping. Oh my.
  17. 17. IT WAS PROFOUNDLY DIFFERENT ! I HADN’T CHANGED AGENCY, I HAD CHANGED CAREER(!) ! I’M GOING TO EXPLAIN HOW IT WAS DIFFERENT, BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, WHY…
  18. 18. IT ALL COMES DOWN TO… How success is judged
  19. 19. IT ALL COMES DOWN TO… FORGET WHETHER OUTPUT IS CALLED A ‘PRODUCT’ OR NOT…
  20. 20. FORGET WHETHER OUTPUT IS CALLED A ‘PRODUCT’ OR NOT… Are you trying to earn a momentary reaction… or an ongoing role in people’s lives? Reaction Role
  21. 21. FORGET WHETHER OUTPUT IS CALLED A ‘PRODUCT’ OR NOT… Are you trying to earn a momentary reaction… or an ongoing role in people’s lives? Reaction Role SECONDS vs MONTHS
  22. 22. A ‘product’ built to achieve short term marketing goals *is* short term marketing (THIS IS SO SIMPLE BUT IMPORTANT)
  23. 23. THIS ONE DIFFERENCE… REACTION VS ROLE HAS A MASSIVE IMPACT ON EVERYTHING YOU DO IT SHAKES THE AGENCY MODEL TO ITS CORE BRINGING NEW NEEDS, RISKS AND CHALLENGES THAT REQUIRE DIFFERENT ROLES, VALUES AND PROCESSES. Examples follow…
  24. 24. Marketing Product innovation • Ideas are the most valuable thing • Strategies are sold in • Minimum success is certain • Attention can be bought • Desired effect is easy to test • Deliverables are clear • Budgets are fixed • It’s separate from the business • It doesn’t need supporting • Ideas are just hypotheses • Strategies are adjustable • Total failure is a definite possibility • Users can’t be bought • Ongoing usage hard to test • Deliverables are unknown • Costs are completely unknown • Must integrate with the business • It needs an operational plan
  25. 25. Guessing what’s going to work is a fool’s game Photo: REX Features via
  26. 26. THE SIMPLE TRUTH IS THAT ALL STRATEGY AND ‘IDEAS’ ARE GUESSES. AND THAT GUESSING PRECISELY WHAT PRODUCT WILL BE LOVED BY MILLIONS, DAILY IS PRETTY MUCH IMPOSSIBLE… Photo: REX Features via
  27. 27. A STUDY SHOWED THAT OUT OF 400 MBA GRADUATES FROM HARVARD… 96.5% ..OF THEM FAILED IN THEIR VENTURES WHEN FOLLOWING THEIR ORIGINAL STRATEGY THAT’S A NUMBER WANG! Photo by Paul Marotta / Getty Images
  28. 28. Don’t do upfront thinking How far do you go before checking?
  29. 29. Don’t do upfront thinking How far do you go before checking? PEOPLE GET IN SILLY ARGUMENTS ABOUT THIS; IT ISN’T AN ARGUMENT ABOUT DOING STRATEGY OR *NOT* DOING STRATEGY IT’S A QUESTION OF TRADE OFFS: HOW FAR DOWN A PARTICULAR ROAD SHOULD YOU GO BEFORE SEEING IF YOU WERE RIGHT?
  30. 30. SADLY, ONE OF THE BIGGEST BARRIERS TO SENSIBLY ASKING THIS QUESTION IS PEOPLE AND AGENCIES PROTECTING THEIR LEGACY VALUE…
  31. 31. and individuals "Institutions will try to preserve the problem to which they are the solution" - Clay Shirky - Me
  32. 32. SOME OF THE RISKS OF GOING TOO FAR WITHOUT CHECKING… You develop a tight business model, but it turns out people don’t want this product
  33. 33. SOME OF THE RISKS OF GOING TOO FAR WITHOUT CHECKING… You design a great customer experience, but it turns out you can’t afford to build it
  34. 34. SOME OF THE RISKS OF GOING TOO FAR WITHOUT CHECKING… You work out a great technology solution, but it compromises the revenue plan
  35. 35. IT’S WHY MXM WORKS IN TIGHT CYCLES INSTEAD OF STAGES… LEARN MAKE TEST
  36. 36. BASICALLY, IT’S REALLY BLOODY COMPLEX DEVELOPING SUCCESSFUL DIGITAL PRODUCTS. IN FACT, THE WORD ‘PRODUCT’ ISN’T PARTICULARLY HELPFUL EITHER…
  37. 37. Website Latest News - ITV New http:// www.itv.com/news/ OUR ITV NEWS SERVICE ISN’T JUST A ‘SITE’/‘APP’ THAT CONSUMERS USE
  38. 38. Website Latest News - ITV New http:// www.itv.com/news/ IT’S AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT SYSTEM FOR JOURNALISTS TO CREATE NEWS
  39. 39. Latest News - ITV New THIS is the product Website http:// www.itv.com/news/ Brand new CMS Apps and site New workflow
  40. 40. ‘Product’ Design Venture Design
  41. 41. DESIGNING ENTIRE VENTURES GOES WAY BEYOND SIMPLY CREATING A NEW APP OR SERVICE. WHICH IS WHY WE’VE STARTED TO HIRE AND BUILD TEAMS FOR OUR CLIENTS TO RUN PRODUCTS LONG-TERM Link http://www.phinhall.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Chicks-in-Incubator.jpg
  42. 42. So we don’t need marketing then? WE JUST MAKE REALLY VALUABLE SERVICES AND THEY SELL THEMSELVES! Hooray!
  43. 43. No, it turns out this isn’t the case… http://dudesinstartupshirts.tumblr.com/ AND WHILE MARKETEERS TRY TO GET BETTER AT PRODUCT INNOVATION, PRODUCT PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO GET BETTER AT MARKETING… http://dudesinstartupshirts.tumblr.com/
  44. 44. LOOK NO FURTHER THAN…
  45. 45. I ORIGINALLY SHARED A REALLY BAD (FUNNY) ATTEMPT AT A KICKSTARTER VIDEO TO HIGHLIGHT HOW BAD AT MARKETING SOME PRODUCT PEOPLE CAN BE… BUT IT FELT A BIT CRUEL, SO I REMOVED IT. I’M SURE YOU’VE SEEN EXAMPLES…
  46. 46. ANYWAY… “No marketing” needs to finally stop being a badge of honour for product people
  47. 47. THESE THINGS NEED ONE ANOTHER service story GREAT SERVICES CREATE STORIES; GREAT STORIES REINFORCE THE SERVICE
  48. 48. BUT YOU MUST START WITH THE SERVICE! service story GOOD STORIES DON’T NECESSARY LEAD TO GOOD SERVICES (I could have gone on about this, but I ran out of time)
  49. 49. ALSO IMPORTANT: Great products lead to good stories, but not good storytelling
  50. 50. THAT ALL GOT A BIT RAMBLY. I TOTALLY MADE IT ALL HANG TOGETHER ON THE NIGHT ANYWAY…
  51. 51. Make useful things THIS IS MY JAM tell stories with them
  52. 52. Make useful things THIS IS MY JAM tell stories with them MARKETING FOLK NEED TO RESPECT THAT PRODUCT INNOVATION IS AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT THING; IT’S BEYOND THEIR EXISTING EXPERTISE AND PRODUCT PEOPLE NEED TO RESPECT THE SKILL AND IMPORTANCE OF GREAT STORYTELLING; MARKETING IS *NOT* THE ENEMY OF UTILITY
  53. 53. I PLAYED SOME SEXY MUSIC AT THIS POINT MADE EVERYONE FEEL WARM AND FUZZY ABOUT NEEDING ONE ANOTHER, THEN WENT FOR THE BIG FINALE…
  54. 54. What have I learned? 1. Differentiate the service before the brand 2. Spend less time guessing 3.Great products lead to good stories, but not good storytelling @andywhitlock SAY HI

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